Adding puzzles to S2E4

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Adding puzzles to S2E4

Postby avec » Sun Dec 13, 2015 5:52 pm

There seems to be a consensus that Season Two, Episode Four could be longer, more challenging, and have more puzzles. I thought this thread could be an area where we brainstorm puzzles to include in the final version. Do you have ideas about puzzles or other kinds of challenges that could enhance the episode?

I included some of my own suggestions below. Feel free to comment on them or post ideas of your own. Cheers!
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Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 11:14 pm

Re: Adding puzzles to S2E4

Postby avec » Sun Dec 13, 2015 5:56 pm

Puzzle 1: The bedroom in the mansion

Current puzzle:

1. Click on the monster in the cage.
2. Watch a cut scene.
3. Pick up the rusty key.
4. Use the key in the bedroom door.

Revised puzzle:

1. Click on the monster in the cage.
2. Watch a cut scene.
3. The monster does not leave a rusty key. Instead, Wakefield finds a blanket lining the bottom of the cage.
4. Pick up the blanket.
5. Pick up the birdcage.
6. Go back outside to the blood and feathers.
7. Use the birdcage on the blood and feathers. Wakefield will pick up some bloody feathers and put them in the cage.
8. Use the blanket with the birdcage. Wakefield will cover the cage with the blanket.
9. The covered cage will shudder and there will be a “caw caw” sound. A crow will fly out of the covered cage. It will pass right through the cage and blanket as though they were shadows. It will fly offscreen towards the mansion.
10. Pick up the birdcage again.
11. Go back to the hallway. When we first saw the hallway, the pictures were reflected in the ceiling. Now the bedroom door is also reflected in the ceiling.
12. Use the birdcage with either the actual door, or with the reflected door. Wakefield will place the birdcage on the ground, just under the reflected door.
13. Use the birdcage. Wakefield will stand on the birdcage. It shudders precariously under his weight.
14. Use the reflected door. Wakefield will open the reflected door and pull himself up.
15. When he enters the room, he sees a crow flying away through the crack in the ceiling.

This puzzle might be easier for players who remember Chapter 6. In that chapter, Wakefield put cloths over birdcages.

Maybe the blanket should have the words “if the birds fall silent…” embroidered on it. However, that’s one of Wakefield’s memories, and maybe you’re not supposed to access your own memories in the Veil? Wasn’t there something about how the bird and snake should not meet, lest madness occur? (Though by that logic, the birdcage shouldn't be there either, since I think it's part of Wakefield's memories, not Anthony's.)

Edit: There would also need to be a reason why Wakefield could not carry the birdcage around with him after he put the bloody feathers in it. Since most of the chapter is motivated by dream logic, it's possible that adding the feathers would make the cage too heavy to move. After the bird departs, the cage becomes portable again. Another possibility would be to eliminate the blanket and have the shadow creature's cage be a birdcage. After the creature disappears, Wakefield simply picks up the cage and adds it to his inventory.

Puzzle 2: The golden key

Current puzzle:

1. Enter the bedroom
2. Touch the creature on the bed
3. Watch a cut scene. (This scene takes place in Anthony’s lab. It is the only cutscene where you can control the character.)
4. Pick up the disc
5. Use the disc with the gramophone.
6. Follow the sound to the basement.
7. Touch the cat. A golden key is added to the inventory.
8. Go to the lynx room.
9. Use the golden key on the trapdoor.

Revised puzzle:

1. Enter the bedroom
2. Touch the creature on the bed
3. Watch a cut scene.
4. Afterwards, the creature is still on the bed. You can click on the creature to re-enter this memory. You can do this as many times as you want. After the first time, you can exit the memory by having Anthony use the door.
5. Pick up the disc
6. Use the disc with the gramophone.
7. Follow the sound to the lynx room (not to the basement).
8. Examine the lynx room, but you can’t do anything.
9. Go back to the bedroom and re-enter Anthony’s memory. If you have entered the lynx room, there will now be a bloody knife hanging on the wall.
10. Pick up the knife.
11. Use the knife with the lynx. Anthony will stab the lynx’s eyes. Once he does this, he starts hyperventilating and the memory ends.
12. This time, the creature on the bed is gone and the memory is no longer accessible.
13. Go back to the lynx room.
14. The lynx is unchanged, but its shadow is now deformed and horrifying.
15. The deformed shadow seems to be gesturing to a featureless portion of the wall.
16. Click on the general area that the shadow points to.
17. Wakefield will say, “There is a hole in the wall.”
18. Click on the hole.
19. Wakefield will reach deep into the hole and pull out the golden key.
20. Use the golden key on the trapdoor.

Puzzle 3: Playing the piano

Current puzzle:

1. Go to the “right” classroom.
2. Watch a cutscene.
3. Go to the “left” piano.
4. Pick up the piano key.
5. Go to the “left” classroom.
6. Watch a cutscene.
7. Pick up the sheet music.
8. Go to the “right” piano.
9. Use the key and the sheet music with the piano.
10. Play the piano.
11. Go back to the “left” piano.
12. Watch a cutscene.

Revised puzzle:

1. Go to the “right” classroom.
2. Watch a cutscene.
3. In the classroom, pick up a piece of paper. It is covered in black spots of various sizes. Most of the spots are small.
4. Also pick up a pencil and a blank sheet of paper.
5. Go to the “left” classroom.
6. Watch a cutscene.
7. In this classroom, there is another piece of paper. It has long straight lines on it. There are four sets of five lines each. The lines in each set run parallel to each other. However, the four sets of lines are not parallel to each other. (Though it’s not apparent right away, the lines are blank musical staves (the kind that is used in sheet music). Unlike most sheet music, the staves are not parallel to each other.)
8. Go back to the “right” classroom.
9. Use the “lines” paper and the “spots” paper on the window of dazzling light. Wakefield will superimpose the sheets in front of the window. The light will shine through the pages, causing the images to be superimposed on each other. Some of the spots have lines going through them. If you look only at the spots that a line goes through, and ignore the other spots, you can see that the spots are musical notes.
10. While looking at the superimposed image, use the blank paper with the pencil.
11. Wakefield will reproduce the musical staves and notes on the third sheet. It is now sheet music.
12. Go to the “right” piano (the one that’s mostly functional)
13. Use the sheet music with the piano. Wakefield will play the tune. However, one note is consistently false. He notices that the corresponding key is old and worn out. (This makes no sense from a mechanical standpoint, but it's dream logic.)
14. Go to the “left” piano (the one that’s missing most of its keys)
15. Use the piano. Wakefield will yank the appropriate key from that piano. As he does, the piano makes unhappy noises. Perhaps it makes the “horror piano noises” that we sometimes heard in earlier chapters.
16. A piano key is added to the inventory. (For added effect, there could be blood on the key, as though it were a pulled tooth. Though that's getting into Fran Bow territory a little bit.)
17. Use that key on the “right” piano. Wakefield will replace the old key with the new key.
18. Use the piano. Wakefield will play the tune.
19. Go back to the “left” piano.
20. Watch a cutscene.

I included three attachments to provide a sense of what the pages might look like.

It might be good if the tune sounded a little different when Wakefield plays it. I assume that Hugo was playing the tune in Chapter 6, but Wakefield might not be as accomplished of a musician. When Wakefield plays it, the notes are right, but it sounds less musical and more like “plink plink plink.”

If Wakefield tries to superimpose all three sheets of paper on the window, they block the light and he can’t see anything.

If Wakefield tries to use the superimposed sheets of paper on the piano, it is too dark for him to see any page except for the top page.

Page of spots
spots.jpg (8.26 KiB) Viewed 12172 times

Page of lines
lines.jpg (9.13 KiB) Viewed 12172 times

Superimposed pages (musical notes)
superimp.jpg (21.89 KiB) Viewed 12172 times

Puzzle 4: The forest

Currently, there is no puzzle.

Suggested puzzle:

This puzzle is little bit like the “sounds” puzzle at the end of Chapter 3.
1. The forest consists of an unlimited number of areas. There is no reason why each of the areas could not look exactly the same.
2. In each area, there are four exits.
3. When you stand in front of two of the exits, you hear the sound of crows.
4. When you stand in front of one of the exits, you hear nothing.
5. When you stand in front of one of the exits, you hear the sound of a hoopoe.
6. If you take a “crow” exit, you move to another forest area, but you do not progress through the puzzle.
7. If you take a "silence" exit, you return to the entry point (the area with the cultists).
8. If you take the “hoopoe” exit, you move to another forest area. If you take the "hoopoe" exit three times in a row, you solve the puzzle and reach a new area (which has a shadow monster and a cutscene).

For the crow sound, maybe use the same “bird” sound as the puzzle at the end of Chapter 3. Also, maybe the player should not be told what a hoopoe sounds like. Most people already know that crows make a “caw caw” sound. At this point in the series, they should know to not follow a crow, especially when they’re in the Veil. Therefore, logically, they should follow the bird that is not the crow. Also, the hoopoe’s call sounds magical and mysterious. It might invoke a sense of wonder if the player heard it without any introduction. They’d think, “Wait… could that be a hoopoe?”

This puzzle is foreshadowed in an earlier cutscene, where Anthony hears a crow and mentions a hoopoe.

The sound of a hoopoe's call:

As an alternate approach, perhaps two crows and a hoopoe are audible throughout each forest area. As you approach an exit, all but one of the birds becomes quieter. There is also an exit where all three birds are relatively quiet. This would make the puzzle a little less derivative of Chapter 3, since you would need to pick out the call of the hoopoe from "the din." Though it's possible that closed captioning might be difficult with this approach.

Bonus puzzle: (The big head)

In the mansion in the first section, there is a portrait of a large, “strangely-shaped” head. To me, it looks a little bit like the giant head that’s sticking out of the water near the beach.

Just for fun, let Wakefield mess with the picture. Maybe he tries to straighten it, like Devitt did in Chapter 1. There are four positions that the picture can end up in, but none of them are exactly straight. Each time that Wakefield adjusts the picture, the giant on the beach moves its head slightly, or maybe it changes its expression.

This joke (and red herring) would work better if Wakefield could move freely back and forth between the two areas.
Last edited by avec on Sat Dec 19, 2015 9:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Adding puzzles to S2E4

Postby UserName_1990 » Tue Dec 15, 2015 5:29 pm

I think the suggested puzzles look good. Maybe its an idea to make the piano manually playable by the player, with a few playable keys. They can let the player find the right notes through a puzzle. The red herring is funny though a bit crewl, mayb add a small reward? Just like the table bell in deep sleep series
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Re: Adding puzzles to S2E4

Postby avec » Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:14 pm


A lot of people have mentioned that the mirror has potential to be part of a great puzzle. Does anyone have an idea for a puzzle that involves the mirror?

Edit: I thought of one, but it might need some work. When Wakefield looks in the mirror, he does not see his own reflection. He sees Kaufmann's. When he enters the mirror, he becomes Kaufmann. When Kaufmann looks in the mirror, he sees Wakefield's reflection. Kaufmann and Wakefield maintain separate inventories. When you move from one side of the mirror to the other, your inventory changes to the items that are held by the other character. The challenge is to find a way of moving an item from one side of the mirror to the other. I can't think of a good solution, though.

When Wakefield plays the piano, the reflection is no longer Kaufmann. It is the hand monster from Chapter 6. You complete the puzzle by crossing the mirror, becoming the monster, and entering the cave with the piano.

I see a potential problem with this puzzle. There is a sign on a statue which says that the bird and the snake should not meet (or something to that effect). If different people are on different sides of the mirror, players might get the idea that one person is the "bird" and the other person is the "snake." I'm not sure, but I think that might be a misinterpretation of the sign's meaning.

Also, the Blackwell series has a lot of puzzles where you need to hand off an item from one character to another. I wouldn't want to suggest a puzzle that is derivative of Blackwell.
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Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 11:14 pm

Re: Adding puzzles to S2E4

Postby avec » Sat Dec 19, 2015 6:58 pm

Sorry I didn't respond more thoroughly, UserName_1990. I've been a little scattered this week. I think it would be a lot of fun to play the piano, especially if it was part of solving a puzzle. It reminds me of old horror B movies, where a person plays the right notes on a piano and it opens up a secret door. I wonder if adding a playable piano would require a lot of additional programming.

I agree about the red herring. It should have a minor easter egg reward or else the players might get frustrated.
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Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 11:14 pm

Re: Adding puzzles to S2E4

Postby UserName_1990 » Sun Dec 20, 2015 3:31 pm

Yes i agree. I hope the developers do something with your idea's. Do you have contact with them outside the forums?
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Joined: Wed May 07, 2014 10:09 am

Re: Adding puzzles to S2E4

Postby avec » Mon Dec 21, 2015 6:54 am

It's a good idea, though I guess I'm a little reluctant to send them unsolicited emails, especially now when they're probably very busy. In the previous chapters, I had the impression that The Game Kitchen was reading all the posts in the beta forums.
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Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 11:14 pm

Re: Adding puzzles to S2E4

Postby Felscor » Sat Jan 09, 2016 6:52 am

Perhaps to get the piano key across the mirror would be digging up mirror shards from under an old adlar tree?

1. Kaufmann searches underneath an adlar
2. Kaufmann picks up mirror shard
3. -Acquire Piano Key as you described-
4. Wakefield searches underneath an adlar on his side
5. Wakefield picks up mirror shard
6. Kaufmann places the piano key onto the mirror shard
7. Wakefield gains the key into his inventory

The problem with this is the memory thing again about not being allowed to use your own memories (if I'm interpreting correctly).
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Re: Adding puzzles to S2E4

Postby Lunatar » Sat Jan 09, 2016 5:00 pm

I totally agree with adding more puzzles. They could really play with the idea of mirrors and perhaps consider the possibility of parallel dimensions here. For example when the player does something on the one side of the mirror, it also affects the other side, maybe in a reversed manner? Also they should add more usable items and make better use of the already existing objects (like the random puddle of blood and feathers).

I also like to see more "abnormal" puzzles with unconventional solutions. Perhaps the need to go through a door on the ceiling or as mentioned in original post, to reanimate a crow from the puddle of blood to eventually find the key.

Nevertheless, I have enjoyed greatly playing this game and I'm looking forward to the finished episode. :)
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